Can Natural Proteins Reduce our Dependency on Antibiotics in Fish Farming?

Happy Planet Wednesday !

We are travelling to South America this week !

Our guest, Daniela Allerbon, is CEO of Aquit, a company specializing in natural proteins that can be used to replace antibiotics in fish farming. Aquit was founded by researchers in Chile and Daniela recently joined the team as CEO from Buenos Aires, Argentina.

We learn a lot about antibiotics and fish farming in this podcast, but we also get a fascinating window into the startup ecosystem in South America and strategies that  companies outside of the US can use to gain entry into the US market.

SPONSORS & PARTNERS

Many thanks to Maine Technology Institute, Maine Venture Fund and Spark No.9 for their sponsorship.

I’d also like to thank our promotional partners. Investable Oceans is a US-based angel platform specializing in ocean-related startups.

Oceanovation is a fast-growing hub for entrepreneurs and investors in blue-tech innovation.

Transcript

Abigail:

Welcome to the podcast today where we celebrate Innovation for a Happy Planet. I am your host Abigail Carroll. 

We hear a lot about overuse of antibiotics in people but antibiotics in agriculture and aquaculture are equally, if not more harmful. They cause antibiotic-resistant bacteria, resulting in antibiotic-resistant infections for humans, fish and other aquatic animals. 

Today’s guest is Daniela Allerbon. She is our first guest from South America and is the CEO of Aquit, which is producing a natural protein based antibiotic alternative for boosting the immune system in fish.

Welcome to the podcast, Daniela.

Daniela:

Thank you very much, Abigail.

Abigail:

Well, I'm delighted to have you. You are the first person from South America who's been on the Happy Planet Podcast. You are in Buenos Air.

Daniela:

Yes.

Abigail:

And you have a team in Chile.

Daniela:

Yes, that's right.

Abigail:

So tell us what you guys do.

Daniela:

Well, Aquit developed treatments to prevent infections in fish. So what we seen particularly in Chile, where my partners are from, they're both scientists. There is a very big problem regarding antibiotics in Chile for several years. Their producers only had  antibiotics as an alternative to control infections. We developed this it's protein, it's a recombinant protein. There's a treatment that's from the fish itself, they discovered where the fish, like there's a protein from the fish that fits its immune system, like a missing puzzle piece.

Abigail:

Hmm.

Daniela:

And we were able to reproduce it and give it again to the fish of preventive treatment.

Abigail:

Interesting. So when it gets a bacterial infection, is this only against bacterial infections or is this also against viruses?

Daniela:

It could be also against viruses because [Oh, interesting.] What it does, it boosts general immunity. What is called non-specific immunity. It's not tested,in vivo, when you have the actual organism, for viruses, but it was tested in vitro in the lab for viruses. And it shows a very, very good reaction in gut cells.

Abigail:

Does your research team have to prove both to go to market? Like what is the basis for decisions?

Daniela:

We've already tested it with injections in fish tanks. And we had like very good results that protected the fish against two bacterias that are the most important in Chile. They caused 80% of the infections, they protected almost 70%. So only with our product, the fish get like a 70% survival on average.

Abigail:

Got it. So these bacteria, where are they coming from?

Daniela:

Well, there is something very important and has to do with the way in which aquaculture is done. And for economic reasons, you have to produce in a very large amount of fish. It's the same thing with chicken with other animals. But in aquaculture, what you have is lots of animals in a very small place altogether. So diseases spread, at a higher speed and if one gets infected, it's very easy for all the others to get it infected just right away. [Yeah.] So there's certain bacterias that appear, for example, in the case of Chile, because salmon is from cold water and it's originally from Norway. And it was, it was brought to Chile. Where it's not native. Because of that, they have different conditions and appear different problems that are not just in their kind of home environments. And this bacteria, it's one of the very important problems that producers don't know what to do. But it's also appearing in Ireland at this moment.

Abigail:

Oh, interesting. Is this climate change issue with warming waters? [Yeah] That's expediting pathogen movement around the world for sure.

Daniela:

And also there is a very important issue regarding sustainability. It has to do with antibiotics. It has to do with super resistant bacteria. Super resistant bacteria is one of the 10 health threats that the World Health organization listed. This happens when you use large amounts of antibiotics. You know, like 66% of the antibiotics that we are used in animal farming. These antibiotics, when they go to environments, other organisms learn how to resist antibiotics. So when they become resistant to antibiotics, and then they infect us as humans and other animals, there's no antibiotic that works with that.

Abigail:

Right. Our global mission, one of them really needs to be to reduce our dependence on antibiotics. So you've identified two, you know, bacterial infections that really produce the vast majority of problems mm-hmm. <affirmative> in these aquaculture environments. For the lay people like me, what does that mean to find a protein and how do you go on that search?

Daniela:

Well, it's a very interesting question. The idea is that there are very important proteins that have specific functions within the body. And what we discovered is that some of the proteins and the fish there are key to tell their immune system to prepare. So we identified a protein of the own fish that has this job. And we were able then, like first we detected that we had that task and the body and the fish organism. And then we said, okay, if we can reproduce this protein and give it again to the fish, the fish will know that it has to protect itself. A smarter way because vaccines only produce very specific immunity, certain pathogens for certain diseases. So in this case, what we do is we boost the general immunity. [Yeah.] So the fish is protected against any threats.

Abigail:

So I mean, in aquaculture as you mentioned before, they need economies of scale. So that's a lot of fish. How does that work?

Daniela:

It amazed me when I first knew that the fish were injected because you have to imagine each, each single fish being injected, like the amount of hours that it takes. But like vaccines are mandatory and they have to be injected. [Okay.] We don't have yet oral vaccines.  So as they are mandatory, our product can collaborate vaccines to deliver better efficacy. But we are working on the oral formulation. So with the oral formulation, we are able to deliver the product directly to reach the gut of the fish. So in this case, you avoid handling and it's better, of course, in terms of economic, logistic and in terms of animal welfare also, cause it's stressful for them. 

Abigail:

Do you have clients now? Do you have revenue? Are you pre-revenue?

Daniela:

We are pre-revenue. We are in talks with salmon producers in Chile, with one of the most important salmon producers. We are in talks now to make a trial with fish, with cages in the sea. And it's very exciting for us to have this opportunity and also another very important feed company that is interested in working together and putting our product into the batch, the feed batch. So yes, it's a very kind of turning point for us.

Abigail:

Yeah. So are the farms that you are imagining using, are these open sea aquaculture farms? Or is the trend in Chile and South America, like in the United States where things are coming more onshore?

Daniela:

No, they are open sea. But like the coastal.

Abigail:

Coastal.

Daniela:

Coastal. Yeah. I, I don't see yet the trend of land in Chile at least, or in Argentina or in Latin America. I don't see them yet because, well, we have very, well in the case of Chile, a very long coastal line. [Yeah.] Also Brazil. I don't see the trend yet.

Abigail:

Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. What about Argentina? I mean, you've got a bunch of coastline too, but you know, I hear a lot about Chilean aquaculture. I hear less about aquaculture from Argentina.

Daniela:

We have a very important aquaculture regarding shrimp

Abigail:

Sure.

Daniela:

I don't have  the word for the other one. That's called langostino.

Abigail:

Oh, yeah. Langoustine

Daniela:

The langoustine we have, and also we have a problem in Argentina with the coastal line. We are not being able to monitor it, our, our coastal line and there are many, um, ships from other parts of the world. They come so illegally fish there and they turn off their GPS, you know? We have, we have a problem there. And also we have a problem with the fishing. And then like throwing the remainings and fish that don't fit what they're looking for, like in the coast affecting also whales and Peninsula Valdes, for example. And also we had like, salmon was banned in Argentina.

Abigail:

Why?

Daniela:

Last year, not the year before it, there's a province called Tierra del Fuego. That's the Southest one. After that it comes Antarctica. There was a campaign that said no to salmon producers. So there were kind of very important chefs that worked with that. And they took the salmon from the menus. So it was very important for Argentina. And they banned the, the salmon production Tierra del Fuego that the province

Abigail:

For what reason, though?

Daniela:

For environmental concerns. What you see is that it's not regarded as a very sustainable industry. So that's why it's so important to, as demand continues to grow it's very important to make it more sustainable. 

Abigail:

Totally. I agree. But Chile has different policies. It's a huge driver of the Chilean economy, I would've guessed.

Daniela:

Chile is the second salmon producer in the world. [Yeah.] So you have this two very different realities. From Argentina and the banned salmon production, and the other one from Chile that it's a very important economic activity. So there you have something that  of course they promote, but also the government is trying to strengthen regulations and it's very vigilant. And they are trying to regulate and to measure escapes from the facilities overproduction as Norway does for the licenses. So like you have to accomplish a series of KPIs to be able to get another license. And they also have a law that's going to be presented that they have to present the reports on the amount of antibiotics used publicly.

Abigail:

Interesting. Well, that's gonna be a game changer for people like you who are trying to find these alternatives. 

Abigail:

We’ll be back after a short break.

Break.

Abigail:

Welcome back to Happy Planet.

So you're the CEO of this business, and  you came about it in a different way. You joined a technical team, and this was through a program in South America, and I'm interested to hear more about that, and I'm just kind of more interested in generally better understanding the startup climate in, in South America. I think my listeners would be really interested in that.

Daniela:

Well, in la Latin America as you might know it's very different from country to country. For example, Argentina has a very important public education system [mm-hmm]. so you can go for free to the university in Argentina. So that's one of the main reasons that we have a very important scientific system mm-hmm.  Like, we got like Nobel prizes in the 20th century, like at least four I can mention medicine and biology. That's a part of the reason that we have lots of startups that are biotech startups. There's a very interesting community, startup community. We are always in touch, for example, with our colleagues, with this incubator and helping each other and trying to figure out, how do you did that ,and which is your provider, and how are we going to work together? And it's very, very nice to see that that's kind of a ecosystem flourish. And what I've seen is something quite similar in Chile. And I also participated in a couple of programs in Chile, and now I'm participating in one in the USA.

And I see this thrive in environments where there's lots of people from all ages. Like sometimes we associate startups with very, very young entrepreneurs, but they are like, come from all ages. I'm from people from 60 years old, 50, 30, of course, there's lots of 20 something. But it, it's really, it, it's something really amazing and really invigorating to be there and to feel that. And what we see, some venture capital funds are realizing is that we are able to do lots of things, the same quality with less money. So we kind of, we're kind of having this [Bargain]

This bargaining disadvantage that has to do with, well, the disadvantage of veering far from places where the bigger markets you know, and this kind of colonial look on ourselves, you know, there's something, there's a center, a hegemonic center, and we are outside. But we are used to that <laugh> in one way, but we, what we were not used to being seen. Now I feel that we are being seen as equals in some ways, as equals in terms of being able to, to deliver results, scientific results, and also in this case, um, business results.

Abigail:

Interesting. You've have a very interesting strategy because you actually are incorporated in Delaware, you told me. Can you tell me a little bit more about that and why a Latin American company might do that?

Daniela:

Well, that has to do with something, that's what the same thing that I've told you. The biggest market for venture capital for this kind of investments is in the United States of America. And well when investors look where to put the money, they try that the regulations under some safety. And there's some kind of institutional  framework that stays kind of stable. And of course, the Delaware and the States are seen as much more stable than Latin America as a whole, even though there was a very, very big differences. And that has to do with the incubator in which we participated in. We, like what was a condition that we had to incorporate the company in Delaware in order to receive the funding there. And it's very interesting because in one way, we have kind of one foot in the states, we become more reliable in, in that institutional terms. And it's a way kind of to bypass all this institutional limitations that we have in Argentina, and Chile and Latin American.

Abigail:

So you are fundraising right now?

Daniela:

Yes, we are, we are looking for the seed round. 

Abigail:

And when do you think you'll be operational, presuming that you're able to raise money? What is your, what is your broader vision for the future?

Daniela:

We are hoping then to, in 2024 to scale up production and to test the product in the sea and to be able to start selling right away in 2025 firstly in Chile. And we are working with collaboration with Abbott Laboratories. And with other companies, with other salmon producers, the idea is to start there in, in Chile and then, hopefully launch in Norway, Europe. And of course the states thinking about, well inland production.

Abigail:

Interesting. So what are some of the strategies that outside of incorporating in the United States that you might use to get more visibility in the states?

Daniela:

Well, one of them is networking. We are going to Miami to an event called Bi Hunt. That's organized by the accelerator we have participated in. So there's an event with VCs and, uh, with other startups and kind of a shark tank. 

Abigail:

Our solution works on the sharks too. <laugh>,

Daniela:

Now we're working on the sharks before working with the fish, we have to work with the sharks. That's right. And I don't think about that. Well, networking and making it ourselves visible in like the press. What I found is that, uh, cold calls for investors they also work. But of course, we have to first understand the market. And also there's kind of different cultural issues that we need to understand. In Latin America we kind of value like human relationships and kind and mingle them with work and the US has a different culture regarding that. They more separate social life and work. For example, they, what you expected to say when you start a meeting and when you end a meeting, you know, that small talk that's kind of critical in Latin America, and depending on the country, it's like a lots of small talk. And depending on each country, for example, in Chile, that like, they talk less than in Argentina, and they value fewer words, they're more like US.

Abigail:

Funny. I mean you're attacking a problem that seems to have a direct relationship with climate change. And also, sustainable aquaculture plays a big role in how we're going to address our hunger needs, also faced with this climate change problem. Are you optimistic? You're in the middle of this <laugh>, you're one of the warriors on the front line.

Daniela:

<laugh>, I think we should, I have this idea that we, you find solutions when it's almost late

Abigail:

<laugh>

Daniela:

<laugh>. Right. But

Abigail:

When pressure's on your back. Yeah.

Daniela:

I was raised in the eighties, nineties when the ozone layer was being diminished. I was worried about the kind of the hole that it was going to like burn all us. And then we, we, we got it. We got them the measures to solve that. We did that together. Hopefully, you know, in Patagonia there is a bigger hole, so sometimes I got burned because of that hole. It's harder in other parts of the world. And I, I experienced directly that, so I think that we are going to achieve this when just when we are kind of out of time.I think the SDG goals have done something about that.

Daniela:

That's sometimes it's underestimated because the, it's a huge thing to, to be, to get consensus about a series of goals altogether. All the world. And that's, that's very hard. I understand that, uh, that politics and institutions and how we work together, as a world has a lot to do with this. And if we are going to find a solution or not.

Abigail:

Interesting. So, I'd like to ask if you have any advice for young entrepreneurs.

Daniela:

First, for example, now that I'm in this very kind of specific world of the venture capital and the startups there are some rules that you have to follow that I'm learning on the way that have to do with, of course, having a problem that it's big enough to be solved that have customers willing to pay for it. And you can not only fall in love with your invention, with your solution. What I would say is that try to test what you've created or what you are thinking in terms of if there is someone that's willing to pay for that. Because that's the hardest thing and, uh, the most hurtful <laugh> when you realize that you have like an amazing idea, but it's very hard to be marketed.

Abigail:

Yep. We gotta have a market.

Daniela:

And also to be able to explain that in very plain words to anyone  to your like, uh, like smaller sister, you know, like to your, uh, your nephew, you know, try to, to tell them because if you are able to interest them, then you might have a chance to interest an investor.

Abigail:

Yeah. So do we have to talk to investors in very simple terms? Like we're talking to the five year old nephew? Is that what you're saying? <laugh>?

Daniela:

No, no, but but you have to, there's investors and investors and there's one, I just had a meeting with one, it was kind of a bio chemistry chemist, and he was like new a lot. And it was very specialized and like, was a, was very interesting. Like they kind of taught us things, you know, sometimes you find that, but there's some investors that don't have a clue of what, what's your technologies? [Right.] And you must rapidly explain yourself.

Abigail:

And is that the same advice that you would give to people in both the states and in Latin America? Or would you give different advice?

Daniela:

Well in Latin America, what I said is like, first of all, get to your English as better as to come because this venture capital word is in English, most of it. And try to think in global terms because Argentina, what, it's a problem that we have in Argentina and Chile, that doesn't happen in Brazil. That's kind of a world of its own Brazil. It's more similar to the states because in terms of the, the size of the markets, but Chile, Argentina, Peru, Bolivia, Colombia, we all have this kind of the size limitation that when you have to, scale up a business, you need to understand that if you are not going to be able to sell it abroad to sell it to other countries, you are going to have kind of a small company. You can have a big company that you need to sell outside your country. [Yeah.] And that's a very important barrier. And it's not only an economical barrier. Or technical barrier. It's also a cultural barrier sometimes. And like to have that vision, I think that in the states, I think you must have it, but it's not as mandatory as in Argentina or in like small countries.

Abigail:

I think that's really super interesting, and accurate. And it's interesting cuz I've worked with bunch in Europe and you know, we talk about the European market, but it's very hard to be a French company address the European market because you've gotta do all these different languages. There are different like protocols. And so what I've seen are startups that are born in France or you know, the first thing they wanna do is go to the United States, where there's a big market of 350 million people. Before they go back to Europe and have to translate labels and deal with all of the details. But at least in Latin America, you've got actually a much bigger population that is Spanish speaking. Is there a sort of agreement? There is some sort of [Yeah],

Daniela:

Alliance that's called the Mercosur.

Abigail:

Exactly.

Daniela:

And also that's the, that's, there's another one called the <UNASUR>. And of course when, when Latin America negotiates agreements altogether happens similar things, that's what happened in the European Union. Like, you are stronger. You are bigger. It's easier. It's easier to of course to, to make business within Latin American than Europe or the United States. But, we have different cultures, you have to, um, customize everything for each country. Of course you have, you have a kind of the ability to scale up in the language and there's lots of companies that's follow that path, even editorial companies. 

Abigail:

Thank you Daniela for sharing your story with our listeners. With a growing and hungry planet, aquaculture certainly seems like it has a great potential to feed us all. But it will only work if the methods employed do more good than harm. I must say that I was particularly interested to hear about the about startup climate in South America and how companies like Aquit can strategize to make a splash in the United States. 

Thank you for listening. Please follow Happy Planet wherever you listen and leave us a rating and review - it really helps new listeners discover the show. Happy Planet was reported and hosted by me. I am also the Executive Producer. The talented Dylan Heuer is our producer and editor. Composer George Brandl Egloff created our theme music. Learn more about my work and get in touch by visiting happyplanetpodcast.com.